Kim Walls (@KimWallsLA) is a beauty industry innovator, fourth-generation entrepreneur and the CEO and co-founder of Furtuna Skin (@FurtunaSkin). Her work in luxury skincare has been featured across the media from Vogue, Allure to CBS and many more. She says that her favorite honour was being named one of the "9 Wonder Women of the Natural Industry" by New Hope Media for leadership leveraging technology in early-stage brands to help them grow from concept past their first $1MM.
The charismatic executive shares her story with host Anne Muhlethaler, starting with how as a teenager she worked with her dad — himself the man behind niche luxury skincare brand Epicuren — helping with packaging and logistics. Early on, the second-generation health & wellness expert realised that anything we put on our skin is going to be absorbed by our body, begging the question: what do we want in our body?
Kim goes on to explain how this empowered her to continue working in the natural beauty space, where she honed her skills as a brand strategist, product development innovator and retail and e-commerce expert. Though she also tells Anne how her career felt more like a jungle gym than a straightforward corporate ladder.
Kim also describes how she met her business partner, Agatha Luczo, and the touching, or even romantic, story behind their latest project, the natural beauty brand Furtuna Skin. Anne and Kim discuss its Sicilian roots, before talking about plant foraging, plant circadian rhythms, ultrasound technology and why we should trust the power of nature.
Considered a clean beauty pioneer, Kim shares how much she cares about community, safe beauty, and the environment. With the work they are doing at Furtuna, Kim hopes to inspire many other entrepreneurs to embrace a holistic strategy that could take us towards a regenerative lifestyle.
A joyful, in-depth and very inspiring interview.
***
Selected links from episode:
You can find Kim Walls on Instagram @KimWallsLA - https://www.instagram.com/kimwallsla/
On LinkedIn at https://www.linkedin.com/in/kimwalls/
Discover Furtuna Skin at https://www.instagram.com/furtunaskin/
or on their website - https://www.furtunaskin.com/
The No Doubt Song 'Just a girl' - https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PHzOOQfhPFg
Kim's father's brand, Epicuren - https://epicuren.com/
Steve Luczo - https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Stephen_J._Luczo
Bona Fortuna olive oil - https://bonafurtuna.com/
The James Baldwin quote - https://www.goodreads.com/quotes/512849-literature-is-indispensable-to-the-world-the-world-changes-according
The bi-phase moisturising oil Due Alberi by Furtuna Skin - https://www.furtunaskin.com/collections/best-sellers/products/due-alberi-biphase-moisturizing-oil?variant=32361045852195
Jane McGonigal's book, Imaginable - https://janemcgonigal.com/
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Oleocanthal
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Oleuropein
The song Talk Love by Sonya Spence - https://open.spotify.com/track/0fmzrJ1ibKngaxB5w0v75L
The book How I built This by Guy Raz - https://www.goodreads.com/book/show/48930275-how-i-built-this
***
If you enjoyed this episode, click subscribe for more, and consider writing a review of the show on Apple Podcasts, we really appreciate your support and feedback. And thank you so much for listening!
For all notes and transcripts, please visit Out Of The Clouds on Simplecast - https://out-of-the-clouds.simplecast.com/
Sign up for Anne's email newsletter for more from Out of the Clouds at https://annevmuhlethaler.com.
Follow Anne:
Twitter: @annvi
IG: @_outoftheclouds
Anne Muhlethaler (00:00:05):
Hi, hello, bonjour and Namaste. This is Outta The Cloud, a podcast at the crossroads between business and mindfulness. And I am your host Anne Muhlethaler today. My guest is Kim Walls. Kim is a beauty industry innovator and she works in the natural or clean beauty space. It so happens that Kim is a fourth generation entrepreneur and a second generation health and wellness expert.
Anne Muhlethaler (00:00:40):
I found Kim's passion to be infectious and I really relished the stories that she told me. In particular how she started working with her dad after he founded his own niche luxury skincare brand when she was a teenager. Kim also tells me the wonderful story behind the brand that she co-founded and that she's currently the CEO of called Fortuna Skin and has a really wonderful, even romantic origin story that go all the way to a beautiful space in the middle of nowhere in Sicily. So you really wanna hang around for that. Then we get into the thick of it and I ask her questions about what's special, not just about the work that she's doing at Furtuna Skin, but also what do we need to consider if we are interested in natural beauty and why that matters. We also talk about the key role of technology to help extract the best that nature has to offer. We talk about foraging and how important it is where possible for us to take what is in excess rather than depleting the environment. I greatly enjoyed my conversation with Kim and I'm really excited about bringing you this really fascinating, joyful, and I think really inspirational interview with a real expert and pioneer in her field. So here we go. Enjoy.
Anne Muhlethaler (00:02:05):
So Kim, thank you so much for being here. Yes,
Kim Walls (00:02:13):
Well thank you. You're most welcome. And I couldn't be more delighted to be here.
Anne Muhlethaler (00:02:17):
Thank you. So, as you may have heard before and discovered for yourself, I love to start the podcast by asking my guests to tell their story. Instead of talking about what we do, I like to talk about who we are a little bit more and I love to find out where people are from. And I know already a little bit about
Kim Walls (00:02:46):
Anne Muhlethaler (00:03:06):
I appreciate that. So
Kim Walls (00:03:07):
I'll start with that. I grew up in many, many places, moved a lot as as a child and had, I think my favorite part of sort of that growing up story was my parents were only together long enough to love me into an existence, I like to say. So they split up very early and my mom went and found and made a home on a 30 acre ranch in Idaho and my dad stayed in Hollywood. So I split time between like the lights and celebrities and the this and that of LA and the absolute country where I literally rode my horse to school as transportation. So
Anne Muhlethaler (00:03:43):
That was pretty, I heard that story.
Kim Walls (00:04:01):
Yep, yep, yep. My mom and I would she'd she'd, we'd ride there together and then she'd lead the horse back and come back for me on the horse.
Anne Muhlethaler (00:04:09):
Kim Walls (00:04:10):
My best friends at the time, they didn't have horses, they had lots of goats but no horses and her father built a little paddock for me so that when I could, when I went over to their house, which was about a mile away, I'd park the pony
Anne Muhlethaler (00:04:23):
Kim Walls (00:04:46):
Kim Walls (00:05:42):
And so I grew up, you know, packing boxes in the garage, putting labels on the eye creams before there was enough scale to have machines do it. And kind of that progression of something into a global business and just living around it felt is the closest thing I could say to an apprenticeship. Just seeing it all. So that was very formative and I learned later I studied anthropology with a minor in art history and religious studies. So I, it didn't go into the educational piece there that was really just kind of following my passions and interests. But I always had the, the skincare and the business and that sort of aspect. And I found it very useful when I started working and found that actually I did love that and I did wanna do that and I couldn't help myself from starting businesses because I learned very early that that was a way toward a pathway to kind of doing the things I wanted to do. Like after college I wanted to move to San Francisco and I needed to find a way to have the money to be able to do that. So I was like, okay, well I'll go start a business there. And it happened to be in the skin care industry. So it became like my tool to be able to follow dreams and passions and interests.
Anne Muhlethaler (00:06:51):
That's magic. It's so far from my lived experience because I think that there's, people listening may be completely disagreeing with me, but I feel like there's something very particular as well about the American entrepreneurship spirit. And I find that there's a few friends of mine, whether in the east or the west coast who were already themselves, like you budding entrepreneurs at an age where I wouldn't even known what it was like to build a business. So I read that you are a fourth generation entrepreneur, is that correct?
Kim Walls (00:07:34):
Is in the family? Oh my was different versions of it. I think much earlier and especially hundreds of years ago people didn't use the term entrepreneur And in fact when I was young an entrepreneur was a dreamer and something to be looked down upon. So there's definitely sort of a, a shift in kind of how people relate to words and aspirations. But so my father we already talked about and then my grandfather on my father's side, uh, was a philatelist, which is
Kim Walls (00:08:32):
And so as one of the world's foremost authorities on stamps, he knew the stories behind all of them and started a shop where, you know, a classic shop with coins and stamps and all of these things. But then also a consultancy before Google you needed people who had historical knowledge and reference points and all of that. So he started working as a consultant for people like President Eisenhower to help them think through war strategies and that kind of thing. So that was his story. And then before him was a brewmaster, made great beer Germany
Anne Muhlethaler (00:09:08):
Incredible
Kim Walls (00:09:09):
That Yeah. And ultimately sold that business when you know, you carried it over to the United States and sold it here.
Anne Muhlethaler (00:09:16):
Mm. I'd love to ask you now and what did you wanna be when you were a little girl?
Kim Walls (00:09:21):
I have no idea.
Anne Muhlethaler (00:09:23):
Kim Walls (00:09:24):
I really, I mean I loved everything. I think it's probably one of my faults and also one of my benefits. I just, I'm interested in everything
Anne Muhlethaler (00:09:48):
Awesome.
Kim Walls (00:09:48):
to be in the world.
Anne Muhlethaler (00:09:52):
That sounds great. So at some point I'd love to find out from you, when did you make the, not say the turn, but where did you focus on clean beauty in your entrepreneurial
Kim Walls (00:10:07):
Journey? Yeah, it was always present from when I first started looking at formulas, which was for my dad's company. I never didn't look at them because I think it had to do with the way I was raised. My mother was a hardcore, call it a naturalist. She only believed in fresh food, like really fresh food and only believed in natural medicines unless it was an emergency and sort of she lived that way. And so it was, when it comes to sort of self care just integrated into my experience. And then I think when somebody knows what we'll call it, I don't know the freshest egg tastes like, and then taste something that's not, you can't not experience the difference in taste and flavor in pleasure and eating it kind of. So it started with food and kind of the difference between what people in LA were eating and what people in the country who were eating really beautiful, freshly grown food ate.
Kim Walls (00:11:05):
And then when I started understanding that I was always really interested in nutrition and looking at skincare and knowing, I guess my dad had a, he had a skin disease called vitiligo and that was his impetus for starting his company Epicuren. So his perspective, which I got to experience, was very medically oriented. It had a lot to do with how the body works and body chemistry and ingredients. And so when I started learning about that and how important the skin is in terms of what it takes in and what it gets out, it was just kind of obvious that anything you put on your skin is going to go into your body. And, and then begging the question, what do you want in your body,
Anne Muhlethaler (00:11:56):
Yeah, that's fascinating. Cause I feel like when I was listening to other interviews of you where you talked about again what you put on your skin and I remember several examples that you gave that were very interesting.
Kim Walls (00:13:15):
Yeah, thank you. It is a beautiful brand for sure. It was, it was a jungle gym. I think one of my favorite descriptions of of a career is not the corporate ladder, but the jungle gym can go over here for a while, go over there, you see which bar you can reach, fall down, climb up the other side. That whole visual for me is really powerful when it comes to thinking about my own career and many others of people who really find the place that they love ultimately to work in. So all kinds of different things within health and wellness. Always health and wellness. One version or another. And the late nineties it was internet startups in the early two thousands it was baby skincare because I was just having my babies, my, they're now 19 and 17, so long gone are those days.
Kim Walls (00:14:03):
But it, I always just followed what I was really interested in. I'm a research challenge but can absolute junkie for data and research. So when I get interested in something, I tend to just go deep, get my hands on anything I can, especially original research and read and read and read. End up translating that information into ideas that then I try to parlay into life. And since I, I do love working. I love working very much. I mean the better part of those Idaho days was growing up on a farm and you know, what people say about
Kim Walls (00:14:40):
I loved work. I work hard. That's awesome. And so trying to
Kim Walls (00:15:42):
And so I spent three years with her helping to put a business infrastructure in to match the, you know, I try to match at least the beauty of the brand that she created so that it could go on and thrive. So that was, did that for three years. And then right when that was closing down, winding down, we, we were working on selling it. And as that was happening, I met Aha and
Anne Muhlethaler (00:16:50):
That's amazing.
Kim Walls (00:16:52):
Yeah. It's a very special combination of factors and times in people's lives and skills coming to the table. And you, that sort of magical thread of someone who knows two people who's like, Yep. Those two,
Anne Muhlethaler (00:17:08):
I think that's quite magic.
Kim Walls (00:17:12):
That's
Anne Muhlethaler (00:17:13):
Amazing. Yeah. So I spent a little bit of time on your website. It's very enjoyable. I actually went on Google maps
Kim Walls (00:17:39):
Yeah. In many ways actually. Metaphorically, actually,
Kim Walls (00:17:44):
Did you want me to tell you the story? Oh yes.
Kim Walls (00:18:48):
And everybody loved everybody and everyone had purpose. And you know, there's just this incredible stories. And her sadness came through to Steve and he has great empathy. And 10 year old boy someday, I'm, I get them, see when they decided to start their own family, they now have four beautiful children. Um, but as they went into that journey, they went to Sicily and went to go find that land. And they worked with the church and they worked with the government and they worked with the people and they ultimately found it record keepings and so robust, you might say in certain areas at certain times. But they did, they found it, it was a quarter acre parcel. And on that land they found the rubble of the foundation of her original home. And they rebuilt it. Yeah, they bought it and they rebuilt it At that time they also looked around and saw that it was still very poor.
Kim Walls (00:19:50):
People weren't having access to education. They didn't necessarily have cell phones, wifi and electricity in the way that you might, the um, industry that was once there hundreds of years ago was gone. Agricultural moved elsewhere. Tourism wasn't a thing because it's in the middle of the island with almost impossible access, which I can attest to because the last time I was there, I almost killed myself and four other people in a car trying to get there and pouring rain on a dirt road. Oh, to drive off a cliff. Oh,
Kim Walls (00:20:48):
We all have powers, like in one way or another, use it for good. And Steve had been, uh, ranked one of the top five CEOs in the world by Harvard Business Review, an incredible businessman like extraordinary. And he knew when he looked at this community that he could create economic goodness, bounty because of his experience. And so they committed to do that. And what that looked like was an agreement to buy any land that was adjacent to his grandmothers, including as it grew for anybody who wanted to sell it and to provide employment to those people. And they would do that by building what's now a 17,000 square foot olive milk state of the art and planting something like 12,000 trees
Kim Walls (00:21:46):
He started understanding the land, looking at it, trying to identify what's there, hadn't been cultivated for over four 50 years. So I found all these incredible plants and essentially put together, call it a dossier, a bible, what have you, of what plants were there, what what were they used for, how were they food, how were they medicine, what was the oral history of them, the written history. Um, and it was, it was that compendium given, given the million different names that Agatha showed me when we met. And that was kind of, yeah, given my background and, and interest in food, nutrition, natural medicines, skincare formulation. I saw this list. Like, my goodness, this is incredible. Wow. So in any case, back to the story of the farm, they spent many years, I think we're, we're at 12 or 14 years now, building an olive oil brand with Steve.
Kim Walls (00:22:43):
Uh, it's called Bonna Fortuna and it's, they have all kinds of things at this point. Ancient grain, pastas, tomato sauces, antipasti, I mean like my cabinets are filled with this food. It's incredible. Salts, fennel pollens, I mean, you name it, it, beautiful almonds, just glorious food. Uh, and so many years into that journey, they is when Agatha, who has Croatian roots with her family, they used olive oil for everything, for beauty, skincare, rashes, hair, you name it. And she just kind of got obsessed with this idea, like this olive oil so incredible, we need to use it to, for our skin
Anne Muhlethaler (00:23:23):
Pitched that to you when you were like, Yes.
Kim Walls (00:23:29):
So in truth, I didn't know the true potency of olive oil. I don't have Croatian roots, I have German roots
Anne Muhlethaler (00:23:36):
Kim Walls (00:23:45):
Yeah. So it was the wild plants that got me. And it was the story as somebody who has built brands and helped other people build brands, there are sort of pillars that have to be present. There has to be something real and true. Differentiating. There has to be a story, there has to be like, you can have a great product and many brands don't even have great products. So there
Anne Muhlethaler (00:24:18):
I'm loving your metaphors. That's lovely because you're segueing into my next question, what is it?
Anne Muhlethaler (00:24:35):
And I think that it does encapsulate part of what you explained about the mission for, for the farm and the brand. So I'll read it for the listeners because I think it's interesting for them to understand the depth of care that I think I found particularly fascinating. You said our mission is to leave the people in places we touch better off than what, than when we found them. We advocate for the health of humans, animals, and the earth through our business practices, products and passion. The extent to which we seek to leave things better than we found them translates into more common industry practices like using glass bottles and organic farming methods to the extraordinary like participating in the creation of seed banks and reviving nearly extinct species of flora. We protect bird species and biodiversity. Yeah, I know I keep going with
Kim Walls (00:25:46):
Anne Muhlethaler (00:25:49):
It's great. Can you just do that with other businesses? Can you take over
Kim Walls (00:25:57):
I can see, yeah, I can imagine it. I can, I can see it.
Anne Muhlethaler (00:26:03):
Oh,
Kim Walls (00:26:03):
It's, it's possible. Oh,
Anne Muhlethaler (00:26:05):
It's funny. Hold on a second. So I have a weekly newsletter and I was about to, I'm gonna read you this quote. It's by James Baldwin. It resonates. He says, "the world changes according to the way people see it. And if you alter even by a millimeter the way that people look at reality, then you can change it."
Kim Walls (00:26:25):
Ooh, that just gave me chills. Oh, I know. At, Please send that to me later. Love that.
Anne Muhlethaler (00:26:30):
Oh my. Uh, it's just, it feels very powerful. And now you told me more about Steve. I feel like part of the question, you've answered it already, but how much did this vision evolve as you built a project? Or was it all there in Steve and Agatha's minds as you set off on the, on this journey,
Kim Walls (00:26:48):
The vision for the brand wasn't there at all. Mm-hmm.
Anne Muhlethaler (00:27:35):
I saw it.
Kim Walls (00:27:36):
Yeah. Yeah. So when you see there's, there's sort of been a accumulation of power and wealth that it can be very damaging and harmful. I mean really it is. It's not can be. It is. And so when we get to see people, I mean, to go back to your quote, when you change reality just a little bit and you see people doing things like that, I think it's, I mean, I'll just go ahead and call it a bandwagon. I wanna be a part of
Anne Muhlethaler (00:28:08):
I'm thinking the same.
Kim Walls (00:28:10):
Yeah. So when it came to the farm and the work that was happening there, you know, Furtuna Skin is a standalone brand. It's not connected to the farm. And that work is happening at the farm. It's, it's our business practices going back to that, that allow us to help support these endeavors. And I, it's, it's like an Aspen grow where all the roots are connected underground. If we're all working together in one way or another, putting positive action into the world, then it's just gonna keep growing. And so on that farm, it's, it's the epitome to me of regenerative beauty, regenerative lifestyle. And that's something I feel very connected to is how can we regenerate the things that are around us? How can we fix the things that are broken that are worth fixing and the work that's being done. There is a microcosm of what I think is possible globally. So if we can showcase that, harness it, grow it, then we have an opportunity to really participate and then also show others what's possible.
Anne Muhlethaler (00:29:15):
Thanks. I agree. I think that why the story I guess is so important as much as the product and the truth of the work that you do. It's such a big deal to people to show people the possibilities that are out there. Mm-hmm.
Kim Walls (00:30:05):
Hop on the bandwagon.
Anne Muhlethaler (00:30:06):
Absolutely
Kim Walls (00:30:21):
Absolutely. This comes back to MIMO and his skills and expertise, and that's who I mentioned before, double PhD in botany biology. So he not only is able to identify and it's kind of amazing to watch this guy walk through a field and be like, this is that, that's that. Oh sure. Those two look exactly the same. But no, no, this is this and that's that. It's amazing. So he really has that knowledge. It's, he's, he's been his whole life developing that knowledge base. And so what he's doing now is, and this is part of the economic stimulation aspect, is he's teaching others how to do it and overseeing them. So the teams of people who go and forage for us are growing as we as a business grow. And he's educating and teaching and creating more space, uh, and scalability as we grow to do these things.
Kim Walls (00:31:08):
So the foraging, it's an interesting concept to think about how that can scale because it's really something that's always been very niche, very small. And that's kind of critical to, or historically critical to protect those species. Because if you take everything then nothing will grow. So there's a balance to it. And there's also an element of timing. So there's a dyno biodynamic component where you're looking at sort of different times of day, different seasons, different moon cycles, all of that. But then there's also how much do you take what you know, sort of what's the excess, what is the land's excess so that you're not hurting anything. And then when is the right time, you know, as the petals are just before they may fall or which is both an aspect of protecting these plants ability to keep growing and, and recurring, you know, recurring species. But then there's also a potency aspect to that. So at certain times of day, certain plants have more nutrients in their pets or lesser or you know, they have their own circadian rhythm really is what it comes to, uh, in the same way that we do. And so when you pick them or, or reseed or any of those things, well, we're not reseeding the foraged. We do also have cultivated olive of obviously
Anne Muhlethaler (00:32:27):
Yeah. Wow. Plants circadian rhythm.
Kim Walls (00:32:32):
Yeah.
Anne Muhlethaler (00:32:34):
And someone knows about them. Yeah. That's, yeah. Again, quite much like, um, thanks so much for indulging me. I, I, I feel like I better understand it. I like the way that you put it. Understand what the, what is the excess that you can take without de defeating the land. The other thing that I uh, was very curious about was your ultrasound technology. Yeah. For extracting active ingredients. Would you explain to us what it is?
Kim Walls (00:33:02):
Indeed. So the ultrasound is, it's a technique that was developed within the pharmaceutical industry, started coming into practice around 2012. And so I guess going back to my history in this industry and always thinking about natural plants and organic practices and all of that, there are lots of challenges, inherent challenges in working with materials without creating them in a lab because you have the opportunity to be precise in a lab, whereas
Anne Muhlethaler (00:34:46):
Kim Walls (00:34:48):
So perspectives what we're talking Yeah.
Anne Muhlethaler (00:36:06):
Wow. I so wanna see how you make that
Kim Walls (00:36:12):
It's really cool.
Anne Muhlethaler (00:36:13):
You painted a picture and I feel like I can see it. That's very, very cool. I mean nerdy or cool.
Kim Walls (00:36:20):
Oh, I'm such a nerd.
Anne Muhlethaler (00:36:21):
I love it. Love it. It's, it's really wonderful. Hmm. Now outside of your own brand, cuz I, I heard you say, and I think this is very true for most people who work within a brand, you also love a lots of other products from other companies. But you were offering some thoughts to consumers out there who may not be able to get your product either because it's not available or because of the price point, Let me say it right. I heard you say in an interview that because something's natural doesn't mean it's good for you.
Kim Walls (00:37:12):
So I'll go to extreme example mm-hmm
Anne Muhlethaler (00:38:26):
Thanks for that. Okay.
Kim Walls (00:38:54):
Everything
Anne Muhlethaler (00:38:57):
It's the name.
Kim Walls (00:38:57):
Thank you for loving it.
Anne Muhlethaler (00:38:58):
The name is Due Alberi, no? It's two trees.
Kim Walls (00:39:02):
That's right. Yeah. For the two trees that were original to the farm, Uhhuh, all of the names, everything, everything about we do has instead of layer upon layer of nuance and story behind it. But most people can't pronounce that word very well, including me because I'm not Italian. So really what we call it is our bi-phase moisturizing oil. And what's important about the bi-phase aspect is that it's made of olive leaf water and olive oil. And going back to that with the active ingredients added in, So going back to that potency concept and idea, the olive oil and olive leaf water that's coming from the farm are massively and extraordinarily potent, far more than your typical commercially available ingredients. So for example, olive leaf, very popular, it's the popular dietary supplement has all kinds of great studies around it, the double blinds, all kinds of things for, for both skin and, and nutritionally for all kinds of disease states.
Kim Walls (00:40:01):
So we wanted to test, so we used a third party to do so, the olive leaf water that we are able to make a farm against commercially sourced solid leaf water and found that it's 300% more potent, more powerful than commercially sourced. Wow. So the, yeah, the level of potency that we're talking about here is it's not small
Kim Walls (00:40:57):
And where I think that's really interesting from a skincare perspective is that a big part of how these oils are judged is their flavor. Mm-hmm.
Anne Muhlethaler (00:42:12):
Yeah. Um hmm. I'm so glad that you explained that because of course it's, it stands to reason that, that there is something between the taste and the chemicals and, and that what's very special is going to be very special in, in multiple ways. So I believe you're also bringing your Fortuna olive oil out on the market soon. Am I correct?
Kim Walls (00:42:38):
Yes. It launched two days ago.
Anne Muhlethaler (00:42:41):
Congratulations.
Kim Walls (00:42:44):
Thank you. This is Agatha's brainchild and very much a dream for her to bring together all the aspects, um, of what olive oil can do to all the different ways and modalities to create health and to see that olive oil in our skincare as well. Like it's back to make sure I answer your question about the bi-phase. Moisturizing oil. Oils on the market are insufficient to hydrate because they're only oil. You can't, you can't create moisture without water. And so the way people were understanding oils was that they were kind of an end all, be all moisturizing product, but that would only be true if they were using hydrating products before or if they had just come out of the bath or shower where the skin was already plumed and filled with ample levels of hydration. So we, part of what we wanted to do with our skincare is create multi beneficial products and by combining the oil with the water, it becomes a, a deeply moisturizing and hydrating single product.
Kim Walls (00:43:47):
And then it also has stabilized vitamin C added to it, which helps to prevent the formation of dark spots, age spots, and to help deal with sun damage. And then also something called expo zone 360, which is the survivor plants on the farm. They're really, you know, the ones that really, you kind of look at them and like, how are you alive? You're like hanging off a cliff, you have no access to water or you know, you're sitting at the top of the hill, you're in a sparse environment getting beaten by the sun and whipped by the wind. Like how are you alive
Anne Muhlethaler (00:44:53):
That sounds wonderful. And no wonder it feels so different than regular oils. Yeah, it feels like silky and, I dunno anyways,
Kim Walls (00:45:03):
Yeah. That's amazing. So the bi-phase that you mentioned, that is our best seller and I think it, it helps win the celebrities fall in love. So there's Hailey Bieber, Julianne Moore and that makes a big difference for us. And I think that's probably one of the main reasons it's the best seller. Um, my personal favorites, the replenishing balm, it's the blue balm. I put it on every night before I go to sleep. And it's one of the two products that has that magnolia in it that we mentioned earlier.
Anne Muhlethaler (00:45:29):
Oh, okay.
Kim Walls (00:45:33):
Yeah. So that is, I wouldn't even call it part of my skincare routine. I'd call it part of my bedtime routine. So I do my skincare every morning and every night in the bathroom, but the, the replenishing balmI keep on my bedside table and put it on as a thick mask before I go to sleep at night. And that's, that's sort of the symbol of anybody who's around me. Like, no more talking. No, no, no questions, no ideas. It's time
Anne Muhlethaler (00:45:59):
Kim Walls (00:46:13):
It's true.
Anne Muhlethaler (00:46:14):
This is true
Kim Walls (00:46:16):
You do not tell a lie.
Anne Muhlethaler (00:46:19):
Anne Muhlethaler (00:46:35):
Now one of the first experiences that we get with a brand apart from, you know, the, the usual suspect of Instagram and website, let's say when you're in a store is of course there's the packaging and it's, I mean I've worked in luxury for a long time, so I've seen my fair share of luxury, um, packaging in my life. But it feels very substantial. And one of the first things that I guess I felt before I even considered forming, formulating this in a question, it feels so substantial. Throwing it away feels almost disturbing because of the quality of the glass, it's amazing. Like, I'd want to turn it into something else. So would you tell me the story of this beautiful, beautiful packaging and, and maybe what you've got in mind for the future?
Kim Walls (00:47:26):
You bet. Yeah, I feel the same way, by the way, about the bottles and the practicing. I haven't
Anne Muhlethaler (00:47:31):
Finished the product, but I'm already thinking, but I can't throw it away. So
Kim Walls (00:47:35):
Anne Muhlethaler (00:48:07):
You mean Yves Saint-Laurent?
Kim Walls (00:48:09):
Oh yes, thank you
Anne Muhlethaler (00:49:28):
That sounds great. Did I also read the glass was formulated specially
Kim Walls (00:49:35):
The No, the cap,
Anne Muhlethaler (00:49:38):
Uh, the caps.
Kim Walls (00:49:39):
Yeah. One of the aspects that we, that we were paying attention to is how people use things and how to make this lifestyle. And these ideas really just easy and fall into our everyday choices without struggle. And sometimes it's the little things. And Agatha came up with the idea of having magnetized caps for the spatula. So with the replenishing bomb, the eye cream, the day of night creams, they're in jars and jars by the way, the alternate to that would be for those types of products is tubes and the glass jars are far, far better for the environment, of course than tubes. So just a point of like where these come in. So then you need a spatula, right? Keep your product clean, keep the
Anne Muhlethaler (00:50:29):
That's so cool.
Kim Walls (00:50:31):
Anne Muhlethaler (00:50:32):
I have a very selfish question.
Kim Walls (00:50:55):
That's a big yes. When is that? We're not sure aspect, maybe already noticed, but most people don't. Olive oil in and of itself has an SPF of about eight clinically tested. Oh
Anne Muhlethaler (00:51:07):
No, I do not know that.
Kim Walls (00:51:09):
Yeah. So anyone who's using the bi-phase of their replenishment balm or any olive oil based product, if they've got enough of it on a full layer that is a low level spf, that is not something I'm claiming for the brand that would be against f FDA regulations. We do not call our products sunscreens, but uh, it's just knowledge, right? That, that some of the things we put on our, our skin have the ability to do that on their own. So when it comes to svf, it's actually another business question. So the regulatory bodies around it are very complex. The distribution is very complex. The, it varies significantly by country. One of our goals for for, um, is to be global. And we are currently in Europe and the United States and hopefully going into Canada and Australia in the not too distant future. So the compliance around sunscreens in the different regulations, very really dramatically country by country.
Kim Walls (00:52:10):
So you end up with a lot of business complexity, which can interfere with the true growth of the vision. So it just becomes something that makes sense to do later so that we can stay focused on the things we need to focus on now. But yes, I want one, I've formulated several natural sunscreens before, I wouldn't actually say they're hard to formulate, just it's all the complexity outside of creating a beautiful formula. Mm-hmm.
Anne Muhlethaler (00:53:20):
It makes sense. And I would say that your answer also explains why the few small brands that I've come across, for example, in Europe, are not sold outside of the country that they're in
Kim Walls (00:53:47):
Is
Anne Muhlethaler (00:53:54):
So you've built a few other brands and two of them were actually skincare for children. Mm-hmm.
Kim Walls (00:54:20):
Yeah, thank you. Well, so when I had those boys, I told you about the 19 and 17 year olds. I went looking for skincare for them. And given my experience with Epicuren and my need for natural
Kim Walls (00:55:23):
And the hospital work that was in the book of sales were in China. And the hospital sale, the hospital aspect was in the United States. And at the time there were some pretty harshly harmful chemicals being used on babies in as they came into the world. And it offended me,
Kim Walls (00:56:26):
And then it felt really bad for the parents who
Kim Walls (00:57:28):
And from a business perspective was an opportunity to sample and get products in front of people's hands. And then for the parents and children, it was a way to protect health. So it felt really good about that, but it wasn't, um, a profit center, so that was going to be discontinued. And then the acquirer of that first brand decided to stop selling products into the hospitals because the margins weren't good enough. And the distributor in several of the hospitals were like, Wait a second, we love these products. So they came back to me and asked me to make them more products, certain other brand
Kim Walls (00:58:26):
And so now that that's BEB Organic. BEB is an acronym that comes from Best Ever Baby. So it was sort of the next, the next generation of it. So it's, it's a beautiful little brand and it's used primarily in EQ's for premature babies. And you know, again, since you focus on business aspects, the reason that's possible is because of the mess that is insurance and what, what budgets people have to support health. And there's a larger budget for premature baby skincare. So they're able to use better products and that's where that brand thrives. So premees are, are brought into the world in a slightly safer way. I mean, you know, they're struggling to survive, so it's kind of hard to think, oh yeah, skincare is important, but actually it is, their skin thickens in the last couple weeks of gestation. And so when these babies come into the world, they have incredibly thin, fragile, delicate skin. And then on top of that it's being poked and prodded and scraped and taped and so there, Right. Yeah.
Anne Muhlethaler (00:59:37):
Know. It just, I can feel it almost as if it was happening to me.
Kim Walls (00:59:42):
Okay. Sorry, moving on. So that brand, it just exists and it exists by demand and, and that's just that
Anne Muhlethaler (00:59:52):
Kim Walls (00:59:57):
Yeah,
Anne Muhlethaler (00:59:57):
That's very good. It's small,
Kim Walls (00:59:58):
It's a tiny little, The percentage of babies that are born prematurely is very small. The thing is it's better skincare. It's great for any baby, and it's great for any sensitive skin, but that's, but it's, it's origin is that super fragile or your point you mentioned you have sensitive skin, that super sensitive skin.
Anne Muhlethaler (01:00:17):
Yeah, that's really, really wonderful. When I was going through the website and in the various interviews I've, I've read or listened to oftentimes you mentioned wellness rituals and of, of course, we often think of skincare when we think of wellness. And you know that the podcast is at the crossroads between business and mindfulness.
Kim Walls (01:00:58):
Walking
Anne Muhlethaler (01:01:30):
Me. Mm, that's lovely. And during the last couple of years, which I'm sure must have been super challenging, because your brand was launched in November, 2019. Mm-hmm.
Kim Walls (01:01:50):
Music has come back into my life in a way. I sort of, I've always loved music. I took in high school, I found out that you can take music appreciation and get credit for it. Learned that my junior year and then proceeded to have a music appreciation class for every year of education after that, which was six more years. So I really, I love it. I love all almost all music, especially classical. And I'd kind of lost it. I sort of stopped listening and I think partially as technology moved into new apps and I was like, Oh, I don't really wanna learn a new app right now. And, uh, I think there I had a little bit more time during Covid and so started, I think we all, you know, got more and more immersed in technology and music came back to my life. So I think that's probably something that was really helpful.
Anne Muhlethaler (01:02:46):
It's funny that resonates with me, even though I was an inspiring singer and I practiced and sang and was on stage many years, I feel like music is not so present in my life anymore. Yeah. That's, uh, making me think on a completely different topic. I also heard that you have several beautiful dogs at home and that you
Kim Walls (01:03:12):
Anne Muhlethaler (01:03:15):
So
Kim Walls (01:03:15):
They were my childhood dogs, but they, I've had animals my whole life, lots of them. And I do love boxers. They have an exuberance that's unlike any living things, exuberance I've ever experienced. It's just, I mean, it's something to wake up in the morning and be greeted by a boxer or to come home and be greeted by a boxer, it's like so validating.
Anne Muhlethaler (01:03:39):
Kim Walls (01:03:57):
I do. I do. I don't even, I don't think this applies to you, but I think it applies to a lot of people. So
Anne Muhlethaler (01:04:54):
Thanks so much for saying that. Yeah. I did start reading and watching some, some training videos with some wonderful, uh, trainers who were saying very much the same thing. Like the way that I heard people talk about dog training when I was a a kid growing up is essentially the exact opposite of, of what we should be doing. So
Kim Walls (01:05:16):
Yeah. And people still speak that way, you know, there are still many, many people who will tell you to smash your dog's nose into a pile of poop.
Anne Muhlethaler (01:05:22):
I know. Yeah.
Kim Walls (01:05:27):
Yeah. And, and so no judgment for people who are doing that. Just a request to maybe keep learning.
Anne Muhlethaler (01:05:34):
Yeah, I keep learning. That's a good one. So before we move onto my closing questions, I was wondering, is there anything you'd like to add, perhaps about the brand or anything else that yeah we haven't covered in this interview so far?
Kim Walls (01:05:54):
Just gratitude for you, appreciation for the stories you're bringing to life and for thinking that mine is interesting enough that it's worth sharing.
Anne Muhlethaler (01:06:04):
It's wonderful. And I can't wait for even right from the start, I mean, writing your pony to school, that just
Kim Walls (01:06:11):
Anne Muhlethaler (01:06:13):
Isn't that just wonderful? Well, I'm gonna send it right back to you. I'm so grateful to have had the, the opportunity to go beyond the surface because I think that whenever we have a chance to be inspired by what others are doing, when we see pioneers in any industry, I think it's just a, a rare privilege. Not just to get to know you and, and speak to you in person, but also in the small way that I can give more of a platform to the work that, that you guys are doing because it really does feel very special and, and something that I hope can touch others, um, in the nearest future possible. So with all that said, here are some of my favorite questions and I can't wait to hear your answers,
Kim Walls (01:07:25):
Yes, I have. It's a symbol. It's not a word, although it does spell my name. It has a K and an i and an M in it. But you wouldn't know that, just looking at it. Yeah.
Anne Muhlethaler (01:07:37):
Oh, that's awesome. What does it represent?
Kim Walls (01:07:40):
I think I've spent a lot of my, um, life not being tuned into what I need.
Anne Muhlethaler (01:07:56):
Oh wow. Oh, these two things are related. That's amazing.
Kim Walls (01:08:02):
And so it's just a reminder to have a self-confidence and self-esteem and self worthiness and all those things that I, I truly believe everyone struggles with and I'm one of them.
Anne Muhlethaler (01:08:14):
That's wonderful. Thanks so much for sharing that. That's very special. Oh, I really, it's real realize
Kim Walls (01:08:30):
So, I, this is obscure, but I was asked this by our CFO lately because we were doing a team building exercise. So Furtuna Skin is a globally remote business, we don't have a central place. We have people in Paris and Dallas and New York and all over. So figuring out team building is, is a business challenge. But, so we actually did an internal game with this one. So I really, I went digging and I found it, I found my song, It's by a woman named Sonya Spence, and it's called Talk Love.
Anne Muhlethaler (01:09:01):
Oh, I can't wait to listen to it. So we've got a Spotify playlist from Out of the Clouds. And the wonderful thing is how wildly eclectic it is. So
Kim Walls (01:09:13):
Wait to listen. I'll
Anne Muhlethaler (01:09:14):
Send it to you. Um, what does connection mean to you?
Kim Walls (01:09:19):
Connection and intimacy are very much interwoven and I, I'm not to exclude romantic intimacy, but I, um, but not specific to that. And I, to feel connected, it's my favorite thing to feel. For starters. I love feeling connected and it means feeling like I'm in an emotionally safe space surrounded by love and able to be vulnerable without feeling judged and able to return that and have that be a reciprocal space. That is what connectivity connection is to me.
Anne Muhlethaler (01:09:54):
Hmm. Thank you so much. What is the sweetest thing that's ever happened to you?
Kim Walls (01:10:00):
It's sort of the same. I mean, truly the sweetest thing was there was a time in my life when I completely gave into who I am and all the things that have made me who I am, including the things I wasn't proud of. And I have a relationship where I'm fully present and a moment where I felt fully accepted for all of me. And I think that's it.
Anne Muhlethaler (01:10:33):
That's so fantastic. That's a very, very special thing. I recognize that. Yeah, I know what you mean. Yeah. Or in my way I resonate. What is a secret superpower that you have?
Kim Walls (01:10:49):
Curiosity
Anne Muhlethaler (01:10:53):
Yeah. The researcher. Is that, is that what it is?
Kim Walls (01:10:56):
Yeah. Infinitely curious. And I think, I mean, this is another one I really had to think about, but the, I think the gift that the curiosity gives me is that it's very, it's a, it's a leading trait in my personality and I get curious before I judge. So I, I'm able to, I I work to not have judgment in my life. I think, you know, we all do, and it's an important part of life to be able to discern and judge what works for you and what doesn't. And not to diminish the importance of judgment, but sometimes I think everybody can be a little too judgemental and limit their opportunities, limit their chance for connectivity, limit themselves. And I think I, I think it's a real gift that I'm super, super, super curious because sometimes I don't give myself time to judge until later. And then there's less judgment
Anne Muhlethaler (01:11:47):
Uh, that's so fantastic. I completely understand. I really do my best. I agree with you, of course, discernment's important, but I really, I personally feel coordinated when I feel judged, and that's one of the things that makes me recoil. And so I try not to as much as I can judge other people. But I also found when I was studying to become a mindfulness meditation teacher, that whenever we come across something difficult in particular, if we get curious and we start to decompose, let's say the experience, whether it's a feeling, an emotion, a thought, we can't feel two things at the same time. And curiosity immediately takes over. Um, so that's interesting. It just, it stayed as a, as a real, it stayed as a real secret superpower that we could all do with accessing more regularly. That's funny. Uh, what is a favorite book that you could share with us?
Kim Walls (01:12:44):
'How I built this' by Guy Roz
Anne Muhlethaler (01:13:11):
Yeah. I'm a big fan of his, actually. He's such a great interviewer and I haven't listened to it very much recently, but he's, um, incredible. I forgot about the book. Mm-hmm.
Kim Walls (01:13:34):
The bottom of the ocean.
Anne Muhlethaler (01:13:37):
Oh,
Kim Walls (01:13:40):
Scuba diving. When I learned how to be at the bottom of the ocean and look around surrounded by water, thinking about breathing, unable to think about anything else really, but just filled with wonder. Uh, I carry that with me. That experience of feeling like I'm at the bottom of the ocean, looking up into infinite everything.
Anne Muhlethaler (01:14:06):
I've not done that yet,
Kim Walls (01:14:09):
But if you're not claustrophobic, it's really something.
Anne Muhlethaler (01:14:16):
Imagining that you can step into a future version of yourself, what most important advice do you think that your future self would come and give you, present time you ?
Kim Walls (01:14:32):
Well, I wish I was a futurist, but I'm not
Anne Muhlethaler (01:14:49):
Well this is my final and favorite question of all. What brings you happiness,
Kim Walls (01:14:54):
Connectivity,
Anne Muhlethaler (01:15:09):
You did say that. You, the state that you love the most.
Kim Walls (01:15:13):
Mm-hmm.
Anne Muhlethaler (01:15:14):
Kim Walls (01:15:59):
Kim Wall's la on Instagram @kimwallsla.
Anne Muhlethaler (01:16:04):
Kim Walls (01:16:05):
Again. Thank you,
Anne Muhlethaler (01:16:12):
I hope we'll get a chance to meet perhaps one in person. Let me know next time you're coming to Europe.
Kim Walls (01:16:17):
Will do and vice versa for Los Angeles.
Anne Muhlethaler (01:16:19):
Absolutely. Thanks so much.
Kim Walls (01:16:22):
All right, you're welcome. Thank you. Take care.
Anne Muhlethaler (01:16:24):
So friends and listeners, thanks again for joining me today. If you'd like to hear more, you can subscribe to the show on the platform of your choice. If you'd like to connect, you can get in touch with me @annvi on Twitter, Anne V Muhlethaler on LinkedIn, or on Instagram @_ OutoftheClouds, where I also share daily mus about mindfulness. You can also find all of the episodes of the podcast and much more on my website AnneVMuhlethaler.com. If you don't know how to spell it, it's also gonna be in the show notes. If you would like to get regular news directly delivered to your inbox, I invite you to sign up to my monthly newsletter. So that's it for this episode. Thank you so much for listening to Out of the Clouds. I hope that you will join me again next time, and until then be well Be safe and take care.